Fight the New Drug (00:56.428)
Kyle and Maddie, thank you so much for joining me on Consider Before Consuming today. We’re so grateful for your time and we’re grateful for your willingness to share your stories with our listeners. So can you introduce yourselves and tell us a little bit about what your life looks like? Yes. So I’m Maddie and this is Kyle. I’m the personality of the relationship. So I’ll share a voter.

The Loftins (03:19.256)
Yes. So I’m Maddie and this is Kyle. I’m the personality of the relationship, so I’ll share.
But we’ve got two kids, a four-year-old daughter and then a two-year-old son who just keep us on our toes. He is a plumber and I’m a stay-at-home mom. And we like to do crossfit together. So basically we just spend time with the family and our idea of like a good time is once the kid goes to bed, like we watch our favorite show and eat dessert. So that’s our thing. In

Fight the New Drug
Well, Kyle, can you tell us a little bit about your childhood and what life is like growing up for you?

The Loftins
Yeah. So I grew up in, uh, Illinois, uh, and I had, I had a lot of brothers and sisters. Um, most of them were adopted with special needs. And so there is never a dull moment in our house or I say, hello at all. Like it was always something was happening. Um, whether fortunately like with the special needs kits, someone was like in hospital or other things were going on. And then my brother ran out and me think we were like full siblings. And then I had another half sibling and then later on two other half siblings. so yeah, was a big family and a chaotic at times. But other than that, like great childhood.

You know, I didn’t know any better as a kid or anything like that. So we’re just having fun with each other.

Fight the New Drug (05:13.132)
That’s great. So obviously you’re here on our podcast today to share a little bit about your experiences with pornography. Can you take us back to when you were first exposed to pornography and what you remember about that experience?

The Loftins
Yeah, absolutely. So I was around like eight years old, when I found it, it was on our family’s, computer, that unfortunately, my stepdad had had it on there. and so I came across it and as a curious kid was like, what’s this? and I didn’t know like really at the time exactly what it was. All I knew was like, this kind of makes me feel good.

Fight the New Drug
So pretty common first exposure story, something that we hear often, kind of that accidental exposure, you weren’t necessarily looking for it, but found it on the computer at home. What role did pornography play for you in those early years after that exposure, especially when it came to dealing with feelings like fear or loneliness or anxiety?

The Loftins
Yeah, I used it for everything. Like unknowingly using it for everything. And so like, with more of my childhood, I guess we can we can tap on this, like my mom got really sick when I was was younger. And so I felt that like I had to grow up quickly and be the I was the oldest sibling. And so I like, I had to be, you know, not scared or not vulnerable, like help out my older siblings.

The Loftins (06:50.336)
And so like anytime looking back now, like anytime fear, like anxiety, anything like that, stress came along, like I was going and looking for porn. And as I said, my stepdad at the time, like it was in the house. And so I started finding it more and more. And once you start looking, you’re going to be able to find it.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. And again, like a very common experience that we hear once you find something that can kind of serve as a coping mechanism, like pornography at that young age, then it becomes something that individuals will go back to again and again. Maddie, can I ask you a little bit about what was your perception of pornography when you were growing up, when you were a teenager? Was it something that was on your radar?

The Loftins
Absolutely not. Like, I don’t know how I was so lucky, how my parents were so lucky that, like, I was not exposed to anything. I remember, I think it was the fight the new drug came to our high school and talked about it. And I was like, what are they talking about? And so, like, it was not on my radar at all. So I feel very lucky in that aspect.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah, especially with statistics that we have today, the average age of exposure currently being around age 11. That’s that is a rare experience and such a gift honestly for so many people who are able to have that similar experience to you to not be exposed at a young age. So before you two got married, was pornography something that you had ever discussed? And if so, what were those conversations like?

The Loftins
Yeah, so I knew like, once I graduated, like my parents told me and I learned more that it was like a very common issue. So any guy I was dating, I would ask them if they struggled because I assumed, you know, lots of them did. So I asked Kyle, we are dating. I said, have you ever struggled? And he was open with, he told me that he was exposed at eight and he told me he had it under control, which I think you were in denial at that time. 100%. Yeah.

So like he didn’t have it under control, but he told me he did. But so that was really the deepest the conversation was. Never really dived into it much cheaper than that. Just like, I had a problem. It’s under control now. That was that.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. Do you remember what that experience was like for you, Kyle? Like when those conversations would come up, was it something that like the level of denial you were kind of in, you were just really were like, no, I do have it under control? Or was it something that you remember feeling like trying to be covert about or find your way through?

The Loftins
Yeah, think in those moments, know it’s terrible, but I don’t think I wanted to give it up. It was my Kobe mechanism for everything. And so, it was that freedom. so, when those conversations would come up, my initial instinct was to lie and say, oh, I’ve gone under your control. It’s not an issue. I can quit whenever I want to, and when I’m ready to, but that definitely wasn’t the case.

Fight the New Drug (10:05.388)
Yeah. And we hear that a lot as well. People will think, well, I’ll just when I get married, then I can quit. So it’ll be no big deal. What how did pornography start to impact your relationship and your marriage?

The Loftins
Yeah, it was not fun. Like, I remember the first time like finding it. We were driving home. It was like a six-hour drive and I found it in the first hour.

So it was a terrible drive, but I found stuff on his phone and I was like, what is this? Like we were married a month and I’m like, if you don’t want to be married, like you never did have to get married. Like, what is this? I like flipped out on him and he just kind of had no, like he could deny it or say it was like a one time thing, but he just broke down and was like, I have a problem and I need help. And I’ve been really struggling.

So, yeah, I remember that. And it felt like, I mean, at the very first, it felt like the rug was pulled out from underneath me and I was just so angry. And then once he started talking to me and saying he needs help, there was a sense of compassion and wanting to help him. But yeah, that was when I found out, really.

Fight the New Drug
What was that experience like for you, Kyle?

The Loftins
Um, yeah, that was, I was never an emotional person, um, probably because I was turning to pornography for everything. And so like, never showed emotion. so like, like in that moment, like, especially when she said, like, you don’t want to be with me or, know, if you want to go out and yeah, like go ahead and leave. was like reality hit that like, you, you love, like I love her. And so like you need to accept the fact that this is an issue and you need to work at to fix it. And so like it was, it was frightening to admit that, and very vulnerable to admit that I had an issue that I couldn’t control. But at the same time, like that was the first moment, like honestly, I was addicted to pornography, that there was like, I saw hope and like felt like a release.

The Loftins (12:30.38)
And like weight lifted off my shoulders from holding on to, you know, this burden for so long by myself.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah, not having to hide anymore in that. Maddie, how did that discovery affect your sense of safety in your relationship and the trust that you had in your relationship?

The Loftins
Yeah, it destroyed it. We’re like, you know, like, it’s still trying to rebuilding it. We are rebuilding it, but…Yeah, there’s been lots of times that I have not felt like he’s never hurt me. I’m safe in that aspect, but I always like when it came out months after, like I was waiting for the next ball to drop, waiting for basically it felt like for our marriage to end. So I had no security and no trust. it was, it was the hardest thing because I was heartbroken and, tthe person I wanted comfort from was like the person who like hurt me the most. Yeah. So, yeah.

Fight the New Drug (13:47.138)
I want to just take a quick moment and thank you both for your courage in sharing this and sharing it together. Obviously, this is something that’s so difficult to go through and emotional and it takes a lot of courage to be able to speak about both sides of this experience together. So thank you. Thank you. Kyle, I don’t know if there’s anything else you want to share about, you mentioned feeling a sense of hope in that moment, even though there was kind of this devastation. After that moment, did you feel like there was forward progress or did it feel like it got a lot more difficult before it got easier?

The Loftins
I would say just for like a small stretch, like I’m like, I’m moving forward. This is great. And then like I would, I would mess up. would slip up and go and view pornography. I was like, I am, you know, two, three weeks clean. Like that was like a one time thing. I’m not going to do that again. And so like, I want to be honest with Maddie about that.

And then next thing know, I was in like a full blown relapse with boring unit multiple times a day. and still hiding that from her football line and saying I was clean. So it was honestly like a back and forth for a really long time of like seeing the end or saying like, I haven’t seen the end, like, yeah, feeling that hopefulness, like, okay, this is under control. And then next, you know, two steps back that like it’s.

I’m never going to be there. This is too hard to get over.

I’d say, like, I expected like healing and recovery to be like linear and when like he would be clean for a while and then he would end up messing up and not telling me and so I would find out that he was lying for months on end when that would all come out I would be devastated and I would feel like we had made no progress at all but now where we’re at now like looking back I can see that like he had to learn these certain things I had to learn these certain things and like we were progressing, even if it felt like small steps, like we were, he was progressing each relapse. So like, you know, I don’t know if that makes sense. Like there’s, it’s not, it’s not linear. So, you know, you gotta be easy on yourself if you like mess up because you are still moving forward. Yeah, that’s well said. Maddie, how did you navigate the tension between wanting to support Kyle. It’s so apparent that you’re here sharing the story together, that you have been supported, but then also protecting yourself throughout this journey.

The Loftins
I will say like at first I was very angry towards him. So I don’t think I was very helpful, but then, you know, give it a week and then I’m like, okay, well, he’s a good man, so he’s got a good heart. So I, you know, I’ve got compassion for him. And I feel like… I feel like we’re pretty good at… letting each other grow, but also helping each other, if that makes sense. Like, I will tell, like, Kyle if I’m having a hard time with his addiction and… he doesn’t like…take it out, or like, make me feel bad for making him feel bad, but like he’s helpful in that situation. So, I mean, every day is different with how we navigate it. I don’t think I answered that very well.

Fight the New Drug
No, that was, that was beautiful. And I think not unlike stories we hear from other couples who have experienced this within their relationship, you know, this is a super complex issue. Everyone’s experiencing different aspects of this, especially in a relationship together. Do you feel like you understood what he was going through when this addiction was disclosed or was it something that was really hard to grasp because it wasn’t something you’d been exposed to growing up and it wasn’t something you’d had past experience with really?

The Loftins
At first, I basically expected him to just never view anything again because I didn’t understand it. It even took us a couple years to understand that he was using that to, like, cover any trauma or feelings, but I didn’t understand it at first. Like I got, I was so mad at him when I was like, wanted to know what he was viewing. So I went and looked at stuff and there was like a week where, it was like my first time ever seeing it, but there was like a week where I was like trapped in it kind of. And…I’m very grateful for that experience and I’m grateful that it ended there, but I’m grateful that I was able to experience that and see, holy crap, this is like, it can be addicting. And he saw it when he was eight years old and has been using it for this long. So it gave me a lot more compassion for like what he’s going through.

Fight the New Drug (19:52.546)
What do harder days of recovery look like for both of you, even with the progress that you’ve made?

The Loftins
You go first. I would say at this stage of my recovery, the harder days are when things have been going really well for a stretch, very limited temptations. It hasn’t been on my mind. And then next thing you know, I get hit with extremely hard temptations like, I really want it, or I really miss it. You’re like, unfortunately, it’s like, your brain holds onto everything, like past images start floating in my head. And so like those, those are the hard days because it’s like, I thought this was supposed be behind me that I’m not supposed to deal with this anymore. but like that, those are the harder ones, but the same time, like every time I beat it, it’s just like, you know, another notch on my belt, but like, can do this. Like you, you’re going to continue to get past these and like it does just get easier and easier to withstand those hard days and not let them affect you as much.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. How about for you, Maddie?

The Loftins (21:35.022)
For me, I would say, it’s really weird because I can get triggered over very small things. we could joke. We sometimes joke about our situation and like it won’t bother me. And sometimes we joke about it and it like, like this is the reality of our situation. So I would say the hard days are like when I get triggered over something like I, I don’t know if I…he’s like on his phone, I’m on the couch. Like that’ll trigger me sometimes. And then like, he’ll tell me he’s not doing anything, but it could send me in a little bit of a spiral. But I make sure to tell him that like I’m triggered. then we just kind of talked through it. I let myself fail because I can’t just not, you know, for so long, I just tried to push it all down. Doesn’t work. So yeah, that’s what the hard days look like.

Fight the New Drug
And for both of you, how do you tell the difference between genuine change in recovery compared to the surface level behavior or secrecy? Kyle, do you want to start?

The Loftins
Yeah, that’s a really good question. I would say like taking myself as an example with like going back to my early stages of recovery, kind of like right when it started coming out. Like even after I admitted it, like there’s still part of me that was like in denial that like I really had an issue.

And so then it would step back into like lying. And then I was telling myself like, okay, like you are in control of this. Like you can view it here and there and lie about it and still like not have these issues and be a good person. but like eventually you’re still hiding that. And even though I, like, I would try, like eventually I would slip back to where like I was using everyday human pornography and then like I was angry, irritable, like would snap at the dumbest things. And so like how I know that I’m being genuine is just like how things affect me now. know, like I don’t get, I don’t snap if like the kids are being kids and doing something like writing on the walls or anything like that. Like just the little step doesn’t bother me.

The Loftins (23:42.998)
And then like before there was like a huge desire to lie because lying is a huge part of an addiction. like, there’s been some times in the past where it’s like, I’ve done like a partial truth tell and kept something, but then it like eats at me. So like, I have to go back and go to Maddie and be like, Hey, that wasn’t fully honest of me. like, this is the whole thing. And so like, that’s, that’s how I tell that like, I am being genuine right now in my recovery compared to before where I was being secretive with my recovery and not really in recovery.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah, thank you for sharing that. Maddie, do you have observations?

The Loftins (25:08.446)
Yeah, I mean, it’s a little bit of a tricky question because there were times that I was fooled that he was in recovery. So of course it like makes me feel dumb. But I would say, like, I’ve noticed a big difference with, I mean, how he treats everything, how he is like a father and a husband, and he is doing like, my therapist told me, like, because we’re working on rebuilding trust, she said, time plus trustworthy experiences equals trust. So you got to take like the trustworthy experiences and build them up. And so like, him, like if he comes across an inappropriate picture and he sees it, like he doesn’t have to tell me, I would never know. But like I asked him to tell me. And so he’s always telling me like these small things that probably don’t matter to anyone. But to me, that makes the biggest difference because I cannot deal with the secret. So like when he’s willingly telling me this information, it shows me that he wants to be in recovery and he’s doing the right things.

Fight the New Drug
Right. Thank you for sharing that with us. What boundaries have been most important for you Maddie in protecting your well-being through this journey?

The Loftins
I have told him that I just need honesty at first I like I said, I expected him to just you know, it like you’re good never again and now what I want is like if you mess up then tell me because That’s the only way that you’re gonna be able to be in recovery. So, like, that’s what I said is I need his honesty. Took him a couple years to get to that point, but yeah.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. So commonly when we speak to individuals who’ve experienced betrayal trauma as partners of consumers often do, it’s not even always only the pornography that is the thing that hurts, but it’s actually the lying, the secrecy, the hiding of it. Would you say that’s something for you that early on had an impact and that’s part of why it’s continued maybe to have an impact?

The Loftins (27:32.75)
Yeah, like the lying and the hiding really hurt at first and then I think going like it was like he was good for a month and then it was like a year that I found out that he was lying. So more lies like it just destroyed me. But, It was like five months ago or something. I had found, like he told, I found out he was spending money at the gas station when he said he wasn’t gonna spend money at the gas station. And I kicked him out of the house for a week. Like I was so triggered by the lies that as like, wasn’t even about porn, but like the betrayal, because when you’re lied to about anything, it like makes me question everything. It’s like, I feel like that whole year of our marriage or whatever was a lie.

I was the only person that was honest, so it just felt fake to me. So yeah, the lies are, I don’t like them.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. And I think, thank you for sharing that. I just wanted to add, I think for a lot of people, that’s very much part of the process of rebuilding trust after a disclosure of pornography consumption within a relationship. And I think it’s something that’s difficult for many people to understand if it’s not something that they’ve experienced themselves, if they haven’t experienced that kind of betrayal. I think it can be difficult to understand. so thank you for being willing to share that.

Kyle, is there anything from your end, like how do you feel hearing Maddie talk about that?

The Loftins
Yeah, like there’s, times where I would say like it, it always bothers me. Like just because like that was like I’ve caused that that was because of my actions. and like I would say like the beginning of my journey of recovery, like it would really hurt and affect me. and so like, I would like attack myself worth. which in turn, would just make me want and go over view pornography again, because I was just feeling that way. and then like, as I’m in more and more in recovery, like officially, I’m like legit and not, not hiding and saying that I am, clean and when I’m really not like, it’s like, I’ve been able to like, accept that like she has been hurt by this just as much as I have.

The Loftins (29:44.154)
And even though it’s affecting her in different ways, I can’t be upset with her when she reacts negatively to keep me saying, OK, I messed up or keep in mind about something. I’ve learned to allow her to feel and then take a step back. And then once everything has calmed down, then we can go together and talk more about it. Then it’s the those moments I would say like it doesn’t affect doesn’t bother me or affect me as much anymore as it as it used to because it’s more just like hey, yeah You you cause that but you’re moving in the right direction now and things are getting better

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. And I want to just come in both of you again for being able to sit here and share these experiences with so much transparency and so much honesty, especially given how difficult they’ve been for both of you. thank you again for that. Kyle, if we can talk a little bit about shame. I know that’s kind of what you were just speaking to and kind of beating yourself up and affecting yourself. Can you talk a little bit about the role that shame played in keeping you in addiction and what it’s looked like to navigate that shame?

The Loftins (31:14.323)
Yeah, so shame was a huge part. Sorry if I get emotional on this but I always felt that I was alone with this issue. And so like, felt that way. And like, I just didn’t want to tell anyone. It’s like, just felt so ashamed with it. Like, oh, no one else is struggling with this. Everyone else is fine. And like, even in my gatherings, people would like joke about it or like, I can’t believe anyone would have an issue with that. Just don’t look at it. And so like carrying that always made me think, oh, there’s something wrong with me or I come down to get person. And when you feel that way and have that shame, like it’s, it’s.

The Loftins (31:59.598)
It’s like impossible to get out of the grasp of addiction because shame is what keeps you in there. But when like I finally was able to set that aside and get past that and be like open and not be ashamed of, you know, having an addiction, a pornography, like it made all the difference in the world.

Like, so I started to see that other people struggle with this too, or have struggled with it. You’re not alone. It really is an addiction. It’s really a problem. And like, once I was able to start fighting the shame aspect, like that’s when everything I felt like turned around completely. And like, I really was on a great road of recovery. And like before, gosh, I would never talk about, about my addiction to anyone.

I would even go to like addiction recovery classes and like be so closed off to even talk about it there. and now it’s like, I’ll, fly up and like, yeah, I had addiction to pornography and like, I have no issue, sharing it, explaining it or telling it because like, it doesn’t have that grasp on me anymore. And like, I know how powerful it is and how helpful it is to be open, open about it.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. And just to validate your experience, you know, we hear from so many people who have experienced porn addiction who also feel like they’re alone in this. And part of the reason is because they, you know, a lot of people aren’t talking about this. And so, again, I want to thank you for being willing to share your story and your experience here. Maddie, I want to ask you a little bit about shame. You mentioned that there were times that, you know, when you believed the lies, that you felt dumb because you had believed what you were being told and then reality ended up being something different. Did shame play a role for you in this process and in your own healing in this alongside Kyle?

The Loftins (34:23.118)
I think a little. I mean, there have been times, like, especially when it all comes out, I like just laid out on him, like, shame on you, kind of, and I’m like, shame on me for being fooled so many times. But I mean, I did feel shame for a while. Like I didn’t want to tell, anybody. It took me a while to tell my parents, cause I don’t want my parents to look at my husband differently. And, only one of my friends had known really about it and my sister. And then once I told my parents, they were amazing and they’ve been so helpful and they’ve done nothing but support us in any way we can and have never like shamed us ever. So sharing it with like family and friends has been a cool experience for us.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. Do you want to speak about that a little bit more? You know, really what role have family or friends or community support played for both of you in the process of recovery from your addiction and also in recovery from the child trauma?

The Loftins
So like having a support group or even just like a simple support person or a sponsor, like I felt maybe like the biggest difference like before, I would always like one, like, especially in the early parts of recovery, I tried to use Maddie as my, my support person. but like I didn’t want to hurt her and I didn’t want to, you know, say like, had screwed up. and so like eventually like what happened is I would end up like lying and say everything’s okay. But once I reached out to like one of my close friends who like had also gone through this and was in recovery from pornography, like I leaned on him to like whenever I like screwed up or was having temptations or was struggling, like I could tell him and then like he would, would give encouraging words back and messages and that made it

The Loftins (36:21.902)
so much easier to then go and tell Maddie like, this is what’s going on. And like, I said, like her, as she said, her parents have been nothing but like huge support and help and whatever they can do to help us through this. do. Um, uh, I kind of just saw this space, my tree, thought on that, but eventually I was saying was like, once I had that support friend person I can lean on, like eventually I was able to like start fully being honest with Maddie and everything and then go back to leaning on her as my support. so, yeah, support and family, friends, people that help you, it’s it’s so huge and it’s 100 % needed in your journey of recovery.

Yeah, so my family and my friends, I have some really close friends who they’ve just both been like, they’ve been there when I’ve needed a shoulder to cry on. So if anybody needs to know, wants to know how to support the spouse of an addict, just be there to, you know, let them vent to you.

But something else that I really appreciate that both of them and my family do, it annoyed me at the moment. So like when Kyle and I were separated for a week, I was like venting to my friends and they were like letting me vent. And then they were saying like, you know, you guys have made so much progress talking about how Kyle is a good dad and like saying all these good things about him. And I’m like, I don’t want to hear that. But at the end of the day, I am really grateful that my friends aren’t like bashing on my husband, but they let me cry to them and complain about him, and then they turn around and support both of us. So that has been huge from them.

Fight the New Drug (38:14.926)
You mentioned therapy earlier. Do each of you want to share a little bit about your experiences with therapy, how it’s helped you personally, and what impact it’s had on your relationship?

The Loftins
So I was like always super skeptical of therapy.

He doesn’t like to talk about his feelings, so that’s his worst nightmare.

And like when I was like really young, and like, I had gotten caught with, with pornography. so like, I, I kind of came at that point and told my mom, like, Hey, I have an issue with this. Like, I think I need some help. And, so I got put in like therapy and like, then I was like, I don’t need this. I’m good. And so I ended up lying to the therapist and was like, no, everything’s okay. Like, I have no idea why I’m here.

And so like, yeah, it was always like closed off with therapy. but. like Maddie brought it up that like, you really need to go into therapy and you just need to start talking about this. and so like I’ve had a few different therapists, but like every single time I go through, always learned something new either about myself or like ways to combat

The Loftins (39:36.142)
the addiction of pornography. And I’ve never walked away from a therapy center. That was a waste of time and money. Like it really is great. like, it’d be extremely shocked and surprised on how much just, you know, like talking about past experiences or you’re just, you know, venting your problems can be a huge help. So in the beginning, super skeptical about therapy, but now it’s like, if you really do have an addiction to pornography, like therapy is totally key.

One of those top keys to overcoming and it’s great.

And if you’re the spouse of an addict, definitely are going to need lots of therapy, lots of it. We’ve gotten to a couple different therapists. We’ve gone to couples counseling and that individual, but the one I’m with right now, she’s great. She’s the one that talks about building trust again. But yeah, I’m just working with her right now to be able to not be so codependent on his actions because for so many years I was like, I’ve got to make sure he’s doing this, this, this, and this so he doesn’t screw up. And I haven’t even been working on myself. I’m pretty close to perfect, but I could get better. So I’m like, I got to work on myself. So that’s what I’m working on with my therapist. At the end of the day, if he wants to be in recovery, that’s up to him. I tried to force him for a long time. He will not be forced.

Fight the New Drug
Those are really big pieces of this journey and big things to share. So thank you both. You’ve recently started sharing more openly about your experiences, this podcast being a great example, but in other ways as well, what has that been like for you?

The Loftins (41:32.782)
It has been, it’s been good. So I started sharing a little on my Instagram, maybe like a year and a half ago, just little things. And like so many people responded to me like, thanks for sharing, share more. And so then I started sharing on TikTok and, yeah, it kind of went crazy. So with that, video hit six and a half million views. So there was lots of good comments, but with that many people, there was lots of negative comments. So, I mean, it was hard to see because some of the things they would say is like, your husband clearly doesn’t love you. Like he’s not attracted to you.

And those were things that I thought or I put on myself at the beginning of recovery. I thought I like, I’m not enough. So like when people say that, that’s triggering to me. then having thousands of women DM me, just telling me their experience and like saying, thanks for sharing. It makes like all of it worth it. Cause of course, in the back of head, I’m like, there’s probably people that judge me that know me that are like, she’s crazy for sharing this. But I’m like, every, like everybody knows somebody that struggles, whether they do silently or aloud. So like, it’s such a common issue that I’m like, at this point, I don’t care if people judge me as long as I can help other people feel less alone because it’s like at the beginning when I didn’t want to turn in to anybody, like it was the most isolating feeling ever. It’s been good.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. Are there any responses you’ve gotten? mentioned thousands of messages that really stood out to you?

The Loftins (43:15.566)
Yeah, there’s been quite a few people that have messaged me and said like, proud of you for sharing your story. Like me and my husband were in the same spot. He’s now like five years clean and like there is hope. So like those messages have meant a lot to me.

Fight the New Drug
And Kyle, what was that experience like for you when Maddie started sharing about her experience on social media?

Let’s get this for the right card because you know what comment bugs me the most is like I feel so bad for your husband just sharing his dirty laundry. I’m like you think he doesn’t know I’m doing this?

I mean I stated back like before like gosh, I would never want to admit or share That we have this issue. It’s like we’ll just keep that private but now it’s like sharing is a part of recovery in it and the fact that like we’ve been able to shine light on this and like I said like, you know, I felt that like I was alone in this but like with more and more people sharing it, including us, like, it just shows that like, other people are out there. A lot of other people are out there struggling with this too. and that they’re not alone. and so like I’m all for it. Like she’ll, she’ll always ask me like, is it okay if I share this or can I post this? And I’m like, yeah, absolutely. Like, let it, let it go.

Don’t you feel like it takes away the aspect of shame? It’s like, by sharing, it’s like, we don’t have time for you. Like, sorry.

The Loftins (44:51.276)
Yeah, it takes that. Because once you post out there, it’s like everyone could see it and it’s like, there’s no issue with it. you’re good to go.

Fight the New Drug
Yeah. They say shame thrives in secrecy, right? So I was going to actually ask you about that. How has sharing publicly, helped or influenced the way that you see yourself in your journey of recovery?

The Loftins
Yeah. So I mentioned before, it’s just like in those times of in my addiction, like I felt worthless. that was like always something was attacked. and so as, as I could finish sharing it more and more and like we’ve been going around, and sharing our story, to, places and like, just people that are coming up and like, they thank you so much for sharing like that, that meant a lot or like, yeah, I know some of that’s struggling. Like it’s just reassuring that me that like, hey, you’re doing the right thing. but then like it now, what’s a positive look, but it’s like, Hey, you’re helping other people, people that have felt the same way you have. and like, I know, like I’m not worthless. I’m not damaged. I’m not messed up.

Something bad happen to me when I was younger. I got exposed to it. I couldn’t control that. But I can control what I do with my story. we’re just choosing to try to be open with it and help other people as well.

Fight the New Drug (46:24.184)
Yeah. What encouragement would you offer to couples who are silently struggling, maybe one partner is or both as a couple, this has come up in their relationship, but they’re silently kind of struggling with this together. What hope would you give them?

The Loftins
My advice to spouses of an addict would be, you got to remind yourself that their addiction started long before you. So it’s not about you. It’s an unhealthy coping mechanism they picked up when they were a kid. And it’s one that’s unfortunately everywhere and free and accessible anytime. So it’s a hard one to kick, but also being compassionate to your partner when they tell you they messed up because that’s like the hardest part. No one wants to go and tell their partner they messed up.

But at the same time, the other, like the addict, like whenever Kyle tells me that he messed up, like I’m okay to feel sad and like disappointed and he, he lets me feel that. He’s not like, well, I told you, like you shouldn’t be upset. Like we both let each other just feel the emotions and we’re just there for each other to pick the other one up. What advice would you give?

The Loftins (47:55.598)
I guess yeah, just piggybacking on what Maddie said, honesty is number one. The only way to overcome an addiction to pornography. And so it’s like, when you are being honest, like, especially in the beginning at times like, if you’re sniffing it under, is it going to have negative reactions to it? Not always. There’s plenty of that might’ve just been positive for that. And then there’s other times like it really does bother her. And like, you just need to be able to take a step back and tell yourself like, it’s okay, but she’s upset right now. Like it’s not going to last like you, you did the right thing by coming and telling you just didn’t be another like that you had screwed up that you viewed. but say you’ve done your part and like, you can’t control their reaction to that. You can just control like what, what you do. and so, yeah, just, yeah, I guess my advice is, with it is like recovery is a longer process. Like be patient with it on both sides, be patient with yourself and then be patient with your spouse. And I’ll understand that they’re also going through this as well.

Yeah, to talk a little more, I would say don’t think that progress is not being made if your partner slips up because that’s gonna happen. But you guys can still be moving forward and that’s just part of the learning process. Like each time he’s learned something different, we’ve learned something different, we’ve learned a better way to communicate. So if you feel like you’re not progressing, take a look back, and see like, okay, wait, we are. Y

Fight the New Drug (49:51.104)
Yeah, that’s beautifully said. Is there anything we haven’t spoken about yet today that either of you wanted to share about your experiences today?

The Loftins (50:00.353)
For the men, even women out there, like you’re not alone in this. And like, it really is a legitimate addiction. And it may not be like chemical, like you’re not doing drugs or drinking alcohol, but like it still has a control over you. you know, there’s just, you’re not alone. There’s hope out there.

There’s so many people that are going through what you’re going through and what you’re feeling. The resources are out there to get help. so, if you’re struggling with it and you feel alone, reach out for help because nine times out of ten people are going to be super helpful and respond well to it and be understanding.

Yeah, and I guess I would say I just want anybody that struggles to know that they’re not a bad person. I think, you know, when I was like a little younger, like when I heard the word porn, I’m like, don’t know, but I just know that’s bad. Like that’s bad. You’re not a bad person. You are a human that was hurting and turned to something to help them for a second. And it is, and it can become addiction, but it doesn’t make you a bad person and you can overcome it. And if anybody judges you for it, I guarantee they know somebody that struggles with it really closely that this probably just does it like silently or they themselves struggle and they’re just projecting against you. So with how many messages I’ve gotten, I like knew it was common, but with how many messages I’ve gotten, I was like, this is way worse than I thought, but it’s…It’s great that we’re talking about it because it brings it to light and people don’t have to feel alone and feel ashamed to get help.

Fight the New Drug (52:00.302)
That’s both of you beautifully said. And again, I want to thank you for having the courage to share your experiences so vulnerably and so transparently on our podcast today. We are honored to be able to help platform your story so that others don’t feel as alone as maybe you both did at the beginning of this journey. And we’re grateful that you’re helping with that. And to anyone who is struggling, know there are resources out there. We have many on our website that can help. Or a quick Google search will also lead you to many, many resources. So you don’t have to navigate this alone, both if you’re struggling with pornography or if you’ve experienced betrayal trauma as a partner of someone who has struggled with pornography.

And I just want to say to both of you, I’m so sorry that you’ve had to experience the pain that you have going through these experiences. But again, I’m so grateful that you’re willing to share that with us to help bring awareness to this, and help others better understand really what this issue looks like within relationships. So thank you.