Fight the New Drug (00:51)
Hi Rachel, thank you so much for making some time for us today. I’m looking forward to chatting with you.

Rachel (00:57)
Of course, thanks so much for having me.

Fight the New Drug (01:00)
Of course, to kind of get started, can you tell us a little bit about what life looks like for you and who you are?

Rachel (01:07)
Yeah, for sure. So my name is Rachel. I’m 22. I am engaged. getting married in August. I’m currently in my wedding planning season of my life. I’m a barista, so I make coffee and that’s about it. I live in Redding, California. And yeah, I’m just here right now working and that’s about it.

Fight the New Drug (01:37)
Amazing. Well, for our listeners, the reason we’re chatting today is, as you know, at Fight the Inner Drug, we educate on the harmful effects of pornography. And Rachel has a personal story of how pornography impacted your life. So if you feel comfortable kind of jumping right in, can you tell us a little bit about, you know, what life was like growing up and kind of your first exposure to pornography? Yeah.

Rachel (02:01)
Absolutely. So growing up, grew up in a pretty like society would say like stable home. My parents were together. They’re still together, still in love. I have two brothers. I’m a middle of two boys and I’m a military kid. So I grew up like moving around a lot. My dad retired when I was six. So then we kind of stayed planted and I grew up in Baltimore, Maryland. And I had a pretty good childhood. Like there wasn’t anything crazy that happened.

I got to travel a lot when I was little and then we got planted when I was six. And shortly after that was when I got exposed to pornography. So I first got exposed when I was seven. I was at a friend’s house and she was like, my gosh, you want to see something? And I was like, sure. And then she just pulls up pornography on her computer. And that was kind of the first experience I ever had with anything sexual. I mean, I was seven granted, so.

typically seven-year-olds don’t experience any sexual at all. But so I was seven. And yeah, that kind of sent me down a long 13-year pornography struggle. The first time I saw it, I had like, I instantly felt shame because it already felt secretive. And it was lesbian porn and I had never seen two girls together. So being a little girl and seeing that, I was just like, I don’t really know what’s going on in general. And I didn’t know what sex was.

So yeah, I saw it when I was seven and then I just would go home and go on my parents’ computer and look it up for myself. And I just kept watching it and watching it and watching it and it just became consuming.

Fight the New Drug (03:43)
Wow. Did you tell anyone about that? Like any adults, your parents, about seeing that, being exposed to that?

Rachel (03:51)
Yeah, so I didn’t tell anybody. I kind of kept that to myself. When I was about 10, one of my other childhood friends had told me that she had seen porn and we kind of like bonded, but then we started watching porn together. So the only person that I did tell was also in their own journey with pornography. And I didn’t tell my parents. It’s crazy because I was so young, but I felt like the shame the second I saw it.

Fight the New Drug (04:21)
That’s a lot to go through as a seven year old and a young person. And unfortunately, so many kids, especially today with where technology is at and how accessible it is, are experiencing similar things. So first, I’m so sorry that you had to go through that at such a young age, but can you share with our listeners a little bit about, you mentioned a 13 year struggle after that or a journey. Can you tell us a little bit about what that looked like?

Rachel (04:45)
Yeah, so I hadn’t really understood like the impact of pornography until about two years ago was when everything kind of like clicked for me. I started struggling with mental health when I was about 11. I started feeling really depressed. I started feeling really anxious. I started self-harming when I was 11 and struggling with my body image and none of my other friends were struggling with it. Like to that extent, like of course like you’re going through puberty. So there’s like the

Like, like my body feels weird and I don’t know where I fit, but for me, it was so much deeper than that. Like I was questioning whether or not I was supposed to be here. And looking back now and knowing what I do now, I know that’s because of pornography, because of the shame that I felt. And because of like the extreme dopamine hits my brain had been getting from seven at that point that had been about three years, my brain could only like really

experience that dopamine hit when I would watch extremely rough pornography. Cause I had been watching it for so long. like, you know, I guess like in a sense, like my stamina wasn’t like, it had to be stronger. So I would watch things that were really violent, but I was a kid. Like when I see 11 year olds now, I still get like choked up when I see like the 11 year old girl. I’m like, oh my gosh, like I was so young, you know?

And so I struggled with self harm and my parents found out about the self harm and they put me in therapy and they were super like supportive on like me getting healthy. But I never told anybody about the porn because all that I had heard about pornography was that men struggled with that. So like my brothers would get the porn talk, but I didn’t get the porn talk. I got the sex talk when I was like 12, but at that point I’d already seen porn. So sex and porn didn’t

correlate in my brain. Sex is what like parents did to make babies and porn was a different thing. So I never told anybody. And so I was struggling with self harm. I was struggling with depression. I was struggling with anxiety and I just felt shame. Like shame was the root of everything. Like porn was the reason and shame was the root for me. And so I was in this crazy shame cycle of like, okay, like I don’t want to watch porn anymore because

I’ve been watching things that are so violent and then afterwards I felt so disgusting and I felt so shameful because shame told me that I was a bad person. And it was just huge crazy cycle that tormented my life for 13 years. And I’m now two years sober of that, but I’m still in process of like making my brain feel normal again because my brain grew up like formulating on pornography.

And that was like my stimulant. That was what made me happy. That was when I was angry, like that was my Kobe mechanism. So that was kind of my story, like shortly of like my struggle.

Fight the New Drug (07:46)
Yeah, wow, you said so many, think, really important things in that story. One of the first things was that your brothers got the pornography talk, but you didn’t. And I think that’s something that a lot of girls don’t get. A lot of girls, know, a lot of women who struggle with pornography experience that shame, and so do men, but women experience that on an even deeper level because you feel alone in that struggle. so…

I think it’s so important that women like you are sharing your story and your experiences to help others better be able to understand what this is like. I am curious to know, is there something you wish your parents, other than the pornography talk, I guess generally, like is there something you wish they would have done or a way they could have responded, you know, thinking about any of our listeners who might be parents of young girls and wondering what to do to be helpful?

Is there something that you wish, you know, looking back on this, an adult or your parents would have been able to do to help you at that time?

Rachel (08:47)
Absolutely. I think the biggest thing that I will do for my future children and that I tell parents is just to talk about sex in general and to talk about porn in general. I think that you should be talking to your kids about pornography and sex the second you can. And there’s obviously different ways to do that because you’re not going to sit a three-year-old down and be like, here’s what porn is. But I think that just being honest, for me, my parents did the best they could, but I only got the sex talk one time. It was like, here’s sex, this is how babies are made, this is like your menstrual cycle, and like, this is that. Like it wasn’t, there wasn’t anything about like, how do you manage your sex drive? Or like, what is pornography? Like what are good pictures? What are bad pictures? What should I do if I see something about sex and I don’t know what it is? Like there wasn’t any talk about that. And like for me growing up,

like iPods, all that stuff was newly coming out. So when I got an iPod, I was like the guinea pig kid. So my parents didn’t know about parental controls. didn’t, they didn’t, had no idea like the world that like their kids were walking into. So I think for parents just like talk to your kids about it, off the bandaid. It’s super awkward. My parents know my story, super awkward I told them, but you have to off the bandaid. It’s better for them to hear it from you because they will see it on their phone, they’ll see it in magazines, they’ll see it on billboards, like it’s everywhere. And it’s really unfortunate, but it’s everywhere. So I think my biggest thing is just tell your kids, like there are good pictures and there are bad pictures. When you see something bad, you come to me, you tell me, let’s talk about it and kind of rip off that shame of like, oh, it’s bad because sex isn’t bad. It’s, we’re talking about like the porn, porn is bad. So talking about that and kind of like,
opening up the conversation about it would be my biggest thing.

Fight the New Drug (10:45)
That’s helpful advice that you know, we often say it’s not if it’s when kids will see pornography in this day and age and so we want to help them become prepared to respond in the healthiest way possible and You know adults designating themselves as safe adults for kids to come to and know they’re not going to get in trouble you mentioned you kind of felt that shame because it felt secretive or you were kind of isolating this behavior. So I think those are all really important things to note. And can you talk a little bit about, I mean, obviously we talked about the struggle you had, but can you talk a little bit about what healing looked like? You mentioned therapy, you mentioned opening up to your parents, but kind of what that healing journey looked like or looks like for you as you kind of recover from this?

Rachel (11:30)
Totally. For me, healing has been hard. I wish that my response would be, it’s been great. Really hard. For me, stopping watching porn wasn’t the hard part. The hard part was it felt like I was having withdrawals because it’s an addiction. And it was an addiction for me.

Rachel (11:54)
And my brain had been hardwired on such high dopamine hits from pornography. And so coming down from that and not experiencing that when I’m having a bad day, when I’m stressed out, like that was really difficult for me. I had to find new ways to cope and it was difficult. And also my biggest thing in my healing journey was just the process of like changing the neurons in my brain because the pathways of my brain were totally like out of whack, and for me, a lot of that was when like saying it sounds like kind of cheesy, but when I would feel like the urge to watch pornography and then I would feel shame for even having the urge, I wouldn’t even do it. I would just want to. And then I’d like, my gosh, like I’m still in this cycle. Even though I’m not watching it. It’s still felt like there was like a grip on my life would be to like repeat things to myself. Like, no, like I’m not like, I’m not full of shame. Like, I will be free from pornography. Like I’m not bound to pornography and like repeating those things to myself. I’ll leave myself sticky notes around my room because I had been watching it for 13 years. So it was like an everyday part of my life, multiple times a day. And so for me, it was doing those kind of like declarations in my life and also surrounding myself with people. You, in my opinion, you can’t get free from pornography without people. Like you have to have community.

And so I really leaned on my now fiance, I leaned on my best friend and my brothers. And I was like, listen, like, this is really hard for me. Can I just call you? And like, I don’t even want to talk about it. I just want to talk to somebody. Like, I just need to like get out of my head for a second. And after time, like implementing those things really, really helped. And also learning about what pornography actually does to your brain. Because a lot of people don’t know that it like, rewires your brain and the dopamine hits and all of like the science that goes into what happens in your brain when you watch pornography for an extended amount of time. Once I understood that part of the shame lifted, cause I was like, this isn’t actually my fault. And I was seven. like for anyone that’s been exposed to pornography without consent, like that’s a violation to your brain. That’s not fair, but it’s not your fault. And when you’re in the pornography cycle, like

Genuinely, it’s not your fault that you’re in that cycle and you have the power to get out of it. And once I understood that I had that power, that’s when I really started healing and understanding like what happened to me wasn’t my fault and my brain can actually be okay. Like it’s not gonna be like that forever. Cause I believe truly that my life was gonna be like that forever. That I’d never be able to get married. Like I’d never be able to have a healthy sexual relationship with myself or with other people. And once I started believing the truth, that’s when things really started to feel and like be better for me.

Fight the New Drug (14:49)
Thank you so much for being so honest about that struggle for recovery because I think sometimes looking from the outside in people could say, you know, why don’t you just stop watching? But I think it’s really important to remind people listening if you are struggling or have struggled in the past, especially if you were exposed as a kid, there’s, as you mentioned, so much history of this, right? You had to learn new coping skills and practice new positive affirmations and find a support system and some people that help with that accountability to be able to start to rewire your brain and move forward. So I think that’s helpful insight for people to hear. I want to go back. You mentioned as a kid, some of the pornography you were watching, it escalated over time, right? The types of content became increasingly violent. What did that shape for you as a kid? What did that teach you about your perceptions of relationships and intimacy and sex even?

Rachel (15:47)
Yeah, that’s a really good question because it shaped everything. Genuinely, it shaped the way that I saw myself unknowingly to like it wasn’t like I would watch porn and I’d like, oh, this is who I am. Like, but it was such an ingrained thing in my brain. I mean, you think of like when you’re a kid and you’re watching like, like a TV show and you like idolize the people you’re watching and then you start mimicking them. Like, it’s the same thing with pornography. It’s subconscious. Like you’re not even really thinking about it.

And so I had the belief system that I was an object and that I was just there for men’s pleasure because in pornography, women are treated like animals. Like in pretty much every genre, like whatever you want to say, like women are treated like animals in pornography. It’s very violent. Even in what people would consider quote unquote soft pornography, women are still objectified and men totally are too. It’s not just women, it’s men too, but majority of what I was exposed to was women being objectified. And so I subconsciously was basically raised on porn and I was raised believing that I was an object and that sexual, like there wasn’t sexual pleasure for me. I was just an object for pleasure. And so, and then men could basically do whatever they wanted and that I was there for them. And so I growing up didn’t really have any like romantic relationships with boys. I would have like, little like boyfriends in like elementary school that wasn’t like a real thing. But my senior year of high school, I got into an abusive relationship. And the first time I ever hung out with this guy, I was assaulted and I didn’t consent. And I remember coming home after that and being in my room, shaking and crying and like torn up and thinking to myself, well, I probably should have consented because this is what porn is. So I actually, probably should have wanted that because that literally was what I’d been watching. So I should have liked that. Like something’s wrong with me because that’s all I knew about sex. That’s all I knew about anything. And so it shaped everything for me. And I was in that abusive relationship for over a year, was assaulted multiple times. And I was in this like weird like limbo of like, I don’t like that at all. Like, this is not fun for me. I’m hurting emotionally, physically, mentally, and

Like I know he watched porn too. So it was like, were recreating porn together that wasn’t consensual, but I was like, I should be consenting. This should be what I want. Or like, if I’m not consenting in porn, is like, like trigger warning, but there’s like rape fetishes and people want to be raped and women saying no in porn is sought after. So when I would say no for him, that was what he would consider a turn on. Cause that’s what porn was. So this whole abusive relationship was wrapped in porn. My entire identity and who I believe that I was as a woman was wrapped up in porn. And it was this like really sad and heartbreaking, like back and forth where I was like, I know who I want to be. I know what my heart wants, but what I’ve been raised to believe because of pornography is not adding up. And it was really painful and it was really difficult. And it was really degrading for me as a woman and for the guy who was abusive to me for him as a man, because

He was also raised on porn, which is not at all excuse his behavior. It does not at all like give a stamp of approval to being abusive whatsoever. But it shows the impacts of pornography on the what you consider the abuse victim and the abuser. And that was very difficult. And I truly believe that if I wasn’t exposed to pornography the way that I was, I would not have been in that relationship. Not that that relationship was my fault. It wasn’t. And if anyone’s been assaulted, it’s not your fault whatsoever. But pornography impacted that relationship. It was fueled by pornography. And me staying in that relationship to an extent was because of pornography as well.

Fight the New Drug (19:54)
Yeah, I’m so sorry that you experienced that and I think that’s such a good reminder for young women and young men that what you see in pornography is not a depiction of real relationships or real sex or real intimacy and that you know we’ve spoken with many experts who kind of reinforce the idea that pornography teaches young people, especially women, that you are an object for sexual pleasure or that you have to submit to a high level of violence and you don’t. So as you mentioned, if someone’s found themselves in those scenarios or in a scenario saying, I don’t really like this, but it’s what they like, no one has to agree to anything that they don’t want to be part of. What made you ultimately leave that relationship?

Rachel (20:43)
I think, well, the crazy thing was I was so wrapped in shame that no one knew. My brother, older brother, kind of knew what happened. My parents had an idea of what was going on, but I was so wrapped in shame from pornography that shame bled into every area of my life. And for anyone that’s experienced shame, knows the weight, it feels like you’re carrying around like an 80 pound backpack of bricks and nothing you can do to take it off. Like you just have to deal with it.

But you don’t want to tell anybody you have a backpack on, because you just don’t want anyone to know. And it’s just really, it really sucks. And it’s not a good time. And so I knew the relationship was wrong. We weren’t even dating. Like it wasn’t like he was my boyfriend and it was public. Like we were just like, I guess you could say friends. And so I moved out of, I graduated high school and I moved to go to college.

And the college that I went to, you did Title IX training, which is like sexual assault awareness and all of that stuff. And that’s when it clicked for me that I was in an abusive relationship. Cause I was so in this cycle of like, this is what I see in porn and like, I’m supposed to like this. I’m supposed to look like this during sex. I’m supposed to want this during like moments that are intimate. And so when I was taking like quizzes and reading about Title IX training, I remember like having like a mental breakdown. Like I was like crying. I like couldn’t move. had like, panic attack and I was like, oh my gosh, like I’m in an abusive relationship. Like this is not normal and this is not like, this is bad. Like I need to get out. And once I came to terms that I was being abused, that’s when I was like, okay, like I can’t do this anymore. Like I was already like struggling so much. So I had tried to quit porn off and on my whole life. Like it wasn’t a thing where I was like, this is great. I was like, no, I’m not having a good time. I don’t want to pornography. I feel like crap after I watch pornography. I feel like crap while I’m watching pornography and then before. So the whole time I’m never feeling good. And so I was already in the cycle of not wanting to watch porn. And so when I came to terms that I was in abusive relationship, that for me, I was like, I just can’t. Like I was so like beside myself and confused and hurting.
And so I had really good friends who helped me out of that and the block button’s a beautiful thing and I used it. And I got out of that relationship and that probably sounds easier said than done, but getting out of an abusive relationship is so difficult. I went to therapy again and I talked to people and I moved forward in my life, but porn stayed during that time. So I still watch porn in a way for in my brain was so distorted from pornography that when I would watch porn, I almost felt like, like what’s happened to them happened to me. So it must be normal. So almost like rationalizing like what I was seeing because pornography is so violent and what I experienced was so violent. It almost was like I felt numb and it became like almost I felt brainwashed and desensitized. That’s the word I’m looking for. I felt desensitized because what had happened to me was so violent and so painful, but I was watching things that were so violent and so painful and the moment where quote unquote in porn proceeded to enjoy it. It looked, it looked like they were enjoying it. So then I felt like I should have enjoyed it. So once it clicked for me that my feelings of not enjoying it were valid, that’s when I was able to move forward and get out and getting in counseling and therapy is amazing. And having good friends was really helpful for me as well.

Fight the New Drug (24:31)
Yeah, I think that’s so important to know. think so many people go through that and think, well, I’m supposed to like this. So if I don’t, there’s something wrong with me. And I think it’s important to note that those feelings are valid. There is not something wrong with you. If you had one piece of advice or a couple pieces of advice for anyone who is currently, especially women currently in a struggle with pornography or experiencing an abusive relationship or something similar to what you’ve been through, what advice would you share?

Rachel (25:03)
I think the biggest advice that I would give would just to say that like it’s not your fault. I think the biggest lie that we can believe in watch pornography is that there’s something wrong with us and that it’s my fault because I chose to click or it’s my fault because I chose to keep watching. And we do have a responsibility with what we choose to do with pornography. But in terms of being in a cycle of pornography, it’s not your fault that you’re in that cycle and you have the power to get out, even though you may believe that you don’t. I believed for years that I would never get married, that I’d never be able to have a healthy relationship with men. I believe that all men were bad and that I would just be absent my whole life and that I’m never touching anything ever again. And I am getting married and I am walking in healing and I’m sober from pornography for two years.

And if I would have told like 13 year old Rachel that she would have left and been like, right. So I think the biggest advice was just to be that there is freedom on the other side of pornography and that you’re not as bound to it as you feel that you are. And it’s okay if it’s a process because it probably will be for a lot of people it is. And that process is actually can actually be very beautiful and very healing, even though it may take time. But that time and that process doesn’t mean that you are not healing or that something’s wrong with you. And if you’re in an abusive relationship, like you also have the power to get out. And getting out can be really scary and it’s really painful, but you have that power. And this is someone who’s been through all of that and had heard those things before, but hearing it from someone like me who’s gone through that, like I can, I can tell you that there is goodness on the other side of the pain and the porn and the abuse. And as a woman, we, are strong, women are powerful, and women are able to have healthy relationships. And men are strong and men are powerful and men can have healthy relationships too. And you can have those together. Yeah, and just don’t believe the lies that pornography says, because pornography is lying to you.

Fight the New Drug (27:21)
Well said. Thank you so much. So in your life now, guess, what does advocacy against porn look like for you?

Rachel (27:29)
Yeah, I think my biggest thing, like as a woman is to talk about it. I have walked away from shame and I will tell anyone. I’ll tell anyone what they want to know. I think that it’s interesting because there’s not a lot of, like there’s a lot of studies, but in terms of like, like span of years of setting somebody with the impact of pornography, we haven’t been able to like fully study a life of someone who’s dealt with pornography because so many people have seen it. So there’s not like a control group of people who haven’t. So yeah, I think being an advocate for me is just talking about it and being honest. In my social media, I post all the time on my stories and just not feeling shame as a woman who’s been addicted to pornography, as a woman who’s been impacted by pornography.

And being honest. I really want to be who I needed when I was younger because I wish I would have had a woman in my life who was honest and talked about it. So advocacy for me is being honest and being vulnerable and not feeling shame about my story. I think it’s really important to own the story you have and grow from that and be honest of what you went through. Yeah, so I think advocacy for me is just being real, and letting people know like this is real life. It’s not just like something that like people are passionate for for fun. Like pornography is hurting people. Pornography is hurting relationships. It’s hurting women. It’s hurting men. It’s hurting children. And it needs to be stopped and being honest about that and not feeling like the odd man out. Cause I’d rather be the odd man out about porn anytime than support pornography when it almost took my life.

Fight the New Drug (29:25)
Thank you so much for adding your voice to this movement and for being vocal about what you went through. It’s so apparent as I’m talking with you today that you are talking about this regularly and you’re comfortable talking about it and that you don’t carry that shame ⁓ with you still and I think that’s a message that so many people need to hear, especially people who are currently struggling or have struggled with pornography. And I think it’s a good reminder for them. It sounds like you were when you ripped that bandaid off and started having this conversation with people, you’ve been met with a lot of support. So a good reminder to people to just try to open up and see where that gets you. And a reminder for those who maybe haven’t struggled to, if someone does open up to you, do everything possible not to add shame to that burden that someone struggling may already be experiencing.

Rachel (30:19)
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

Fight the New Drug (30:22)
Well thank you so much Rachel. Is there anything else that you would like to share or something you feel was a really important part of your story or journey that we haven’t talked about yet?

Rachel (30:33)
The only thing I’d want to just emphasize more is just to talk about it. If you’re struggling, I feel like for so long, I would look up By the New Drugs Instagram and like feel so much inspiration and freedom and like understanding. So I was like, oh my gosh, these people get it. And like, I’m not the only person who feels like something is wrong with pornography. Like this is amazing. And I would just encourage you, like if you’re that person who’s like stalking By the New Drug and like wishing you had someone to talk to, to reach out to somebody.

Especially if you’re a woman. I would say like three out of five women that I’ve talked to have experienced pornography. And I would just encourage you to talk about it and to reach out if you need help, if you’re feeling shame and just to know that shame is lying to you and porn is lying to you. And that that’s not like your identity. Your identity is not rooted in pornography. It’s not rooted in shame.

And it’s not gonna take away from you as a woman or you as a man. It doesn’t make you less of a person. And that you can get stronger and be better on the other side and that you’re not bad for watching pornography. And just to kind of change the narrative and change the conversation. Yeah, that’s what I would say.

Fight the New Drug (31:49)
Amazing. Thank you so much, Rachel. It’s been so nice to talk with you. I’m so excited for our listeners to be able to hear what you had to share today. So thank you so much.

Rachel (31:59)
Thanks so much for having me, like genuinely such an honor. Such an honor. Thank you so much.